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"The Creation"

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1 TRANSCENDENTAL ARGUMENT (1) Creation is true. (2) If Creation is true, then reason must exist. (3) Reason exists. (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

2. COSMOLOGICAL ARGUMENT (1) If I say something must have a cause, it has a cause. (2) I say the universe must have a cause. (3) Therefore, the universe has a cause. (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

3. ONTOLOGICAL ARGUMENT (a) (1) I define God to be X. (2) Since I can conceive of X, X must exist. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

4. ONTOLOGICAL ARGUMENT ( (1) Creation is true. (2) Since Creation is true, God must be perfect. (3) That which is perfect must exist. (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

5. MODAL ONTOLOGICAL ARGUMENT (1) Creation is true. (2) God, existing, is either necessary or unnecessary. (3) God is not unnecessary, therefore God must be necessary. (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

6. TELEOLOGICAL ARGUMENT (1) Check out that tree. Isn't it pretty? (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

7. ARGUMENT FROM MIRACLES (1) My aunt Helen was most likely to die from cancer. (2) She didn't. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

8. MORAL ARGUMENT (a) (1) Person X, a well-known atheist, was morally inferior to the rest of us. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

9. MORAL ARGUMENT ( (1) In my younger days I was a cursing, drinking, smoking, gambling, child-molesting, thieving, murdering, bed-wetting bastard. (2) That all changed once I became religious. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

10. ARGUMENT FROM CREATION (1) If evolution is false, then creationism is true, and therefore Creation is true. (2) Evolution can't be true, since I lack the mental capacity to understand it; moreover, to accept its truth would cause me to be uncomfortable (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

11. ARGUMENT FROM FEAR (1) If there is no God then we're all going to die. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

12. ARGUMENT FROM THE BIBLE (1) [arbitrary passage from OT] (2) [arbitrary passage from NT] (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

13. ARGUMENT FROM INTELLIGENCE (1) Look, there's really no point in me trying to explain the whole thing to you stupid atheists -- it's too complicated for you to understand. Creation is true whether you like it or not. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

14. ARGUMENT FROM UNINTELLIGENCE (1) Okay, I don't pretend to be as intelligent as you guys -- you're obviously very well read. But I read the Bible, and nothing you say can convince me that God does not exist. I feel him in my heart, and you can feel him too, if you'll just ask him into your life. "For God so loved the world that he sent his only begotten son into the world, that whosoever believes in him shall not perish from the earth" John 3:16. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

15. ARGUMENT FROM BELIEF (1) If Creation is true, then I should believe in Him. (2) I believe in God. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

16. ARGUMENT FROM INTIMIDATION (1) See this bonfire? (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

17. PARENTAL ARGUMENT (1) My mommy and daddy told me that Creation is true. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

18. ARGUMENT FROM NUMBERS (1) Millions and millions of people believe in God. (2) They can't all be wrong, can they? (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

19. ARGUMENT FROM ABSURDITY (1) Maranathra! (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

20. ARGUMENT FROM ECONOMY (1) Creation is true, you bastards! (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

21. BOATWRIGHT'S ARGUMENT (1) Ha ha ha. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

22. DORE'S ARGUMENT (1) I forgot to take my meds. (2) Therefore, I AM CHRIST!! (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

23. ARGUMENT FROM GUITAR MASTERY (1) Eric Clapton is God. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

24. ARGUMENT FROM INTERNET AUTHORITY (1) There is a website that successfully argues for the existence of God. (2) Here is the URL. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

25. ARGUMENT FROM INCOMPREHENSIBILITY (1) Flabble glurk zoom boink blubba snurgleschnortz ping! (2) No one has ever refuted (1). (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

26. ARGUMENT FROM AMERICAN EVANGELISM (1) Telling people that Creation is true makes me filthy rich. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

27. MITCHELL'S ARGUMENT (1) The Christian Creation is true. (2) Therefore, all worldviews which don't assume the Christian God's existence are false and incomprehensible. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

28. ARGUMENT FROM BLINDNESS (a) (1) Atheists are spiritually blind. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

29. ARGUMENT FROM BLINDNESS ( (1) God is love. (2) Love is blind. (3) Ray Charles is blind. (4) Therefore, Ray Charles is God. (5) Therefore, Creation is true.

30. ARGUMENT FROM FALLIBILITY (1) Human reasoning is inherently flawed. (2) Therefore, there is no reasonable way to challenge a proposition. (3) I propose that Creation is true. (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

31. ARGUMENT FROM SMUGNESS (1) Creation is true. (2) I don't give a crap whether you believe it or not; I have better things to do than to try to convince you morons. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

32. ARGUMENT FROM META-SMUGNESS (1) [obscenity deleted] (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

33. ARGUMENT FROM MANIFESTATIONS (1) If you turn your head sideways and squint a little, you can see an image of a bearded face in that tortilla. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

34. SLATHER'S ARGUMENT (1) My toaster is God. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

35. ARGUMENT FROM INCOMPLETE DEVASTATION (1) A plane crashed killing 143 passengers and crew. (2) But one child survived with only third-degree burns. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

36. ARGUMENT FROM POSSIBLE WORLDS (1) If things had been different, then things would be different. (2) That would be bad. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

37. ARGUMENT FROM SHEER WILL (1) I DO believe in God! I DO believe in God! I do I do I do I DO believe in God! (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

38. ARGUMENT FROM NONBELIEF (1) The majority of the world's population are nonbelievers in Christianity. (2) This is just what Satan intended. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

39. ARGUMENT FROM POST-DEATH EXPERIENCE (1) Person X died an atheist. (2) He now realizes his mistake. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

40. ARGUMENT FROM EMOTIONAL BLACKMAIL (1) God loves you. (2) How could you be so heartless to not believe in him? (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

41. ARGUMENT FROM INCOHERENT BABBLE (1) See that person spazzing on the church floor babbling incoherently? (2) That's how infinite wisdom reveals itself. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

42. OPRAH'S ARGUMENT (a) (1) The human spirit exists. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

43. OPRAH'S ARGUMENT ( (1) Check out this video segment. (2) Now how can anyone watch that and NOT believe in God? (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

44. CALVINISTIC ARGUMENT (1) If Creation is true, then he will let me watch you be tortured forever. (2) I rather like that idea. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

45. ARGUMENT FROM CROCKERY (1) Pots don't go around giving orders to the potter. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

46. ARGUMENT FROM MASS PRODUCTION (1) Barbie dolls were created. (2) If Barbie dolls were created, then so were trees. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

47. ARGUMENT FROM PAROCHIALISM (1) God is everywhere. (2) We haven't been everywhere to prove he's not there. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

48. ARGUMENT FROM UPPERCASE ASSERTION (1) CREATION IS TRUE! GET USED TO IT! (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

49. ARGUMENT FROM INFINITE REGRESS (1) Ask atheists what caused the Big Bang. (2) Regardless of their answer, ask how they know this. (3) Continue process until the atheist admits he doesn't know the answer to one of your questions. (4) You win! (5) Therefore, Creation is true.

50. ARGUMENT FROM INCREDULITY (1) How could God NOT exist, you bozo? (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

51. ARGUMENT FROM HISTORY (1) The Bible is true. (2) Therefore, the Bible is historical fact. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

52. ARGUMENT FROM RESURRECTION (1) Proof of God's existence will be available when you rise bodily from your grave. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

53. ARGUMENT FROM BIOGENESIS (1) Where did Adam come from, dummy? (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

54. ARGUMENT FROM STEADFAST FAITH (1) A lot of really cool people believed in God their entire lives. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

55. ARGUMENT FROM LONELINESS (1) Christians say that Jesus is their best friend. (2) I'm lonely, and I want a best friend. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

56. ARGUMENT FROM ARGUMENTATION (1) Creation is true. (2) [atheist's counterargument] (3) Yes he does. (4) [atheist's counterargument] (5) Yes he does! (6) [atheist's counterargument] (7) YES HE DOES!!! (8) [atheist gives up and goes home] (9) Therefore, Creation is true.

57. ARGUMENT FROM CREATIVE INTERPRETATION (1) God is: (a) The feeling you have when you look at a newborn baby. ( The love of a mother for her child. © That little still voice in your heart. (d) Humankind's potential to overcome their difficulties. (e) How I feel when I look at a sunset. (f) The taste of ice cream on a hot day. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

58. ARGUMENT FROM INSECURITY (1) We have gone to absolutely berserk lengths to establish that atheists are laughable morons. (1.5) Actually, we did so in the hopes of curing our own insecurities about theism -- but there's no chance in hell we'll ever admit that. (2) Therefore, atheists are laughable morons. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

59. ARGUMENT FROM SUPERIORITY (1) If God does not exist, then I am an inferior being, since I am not "special" in a cosmic sense. (2) But I am superior. Because I am a Christian. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

60. ARGUMENT FROM PERFECTION (1) If there are absolute moral standards, then Creation is true. (2) Atheists say that there are no absolute moral standards. (3) But that's because they don't want to admit to being sinners. (4) Therefore, there are absolute moral standards. (5) Therefore, Creation is true.

61. ARGUMENT FROM HUMAN NECESSITY (1) Atheists say that they don't need God. (2) Which just goes to show that they need God. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

62. ARGUMENT FROM HIDDEN LOGIC (a) (1) Intellectually, I know that the existence of God is impossible, or vastly improbable. (2) But I must put on the appearance of being cool and intellectual in front of my Christian apologist peers. (3) Therefore, I must pretend that (1) is false. (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

63. ARGUMENT FROM INDULGENCE (1) Atheists like to think that they can control their emotional desires. (2) But they're atheists, so they can't. (3) Therefore, atheists feel the need to indulge in whatever they feel like without worrying about committing sin. (4) This just goes to show how they need God in their lives. (5) Therefore, Creation is true.

64. ARGUMENT FROM HATE (1) Some atheists hate Christians and Christianity. (2) That's why they don't believe in God. (3) Pathetic, aren't they? (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

65. ARGUMENT FROM QUENTIN SMITH (1) Quentin Smith says that God does not exist. (2) But God does exist. (3) Therefore, Quentin Smith cannot be accepted as an expert on the matter, because he is wrong. (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

66. ARGUMENT FROM EVIL SPIRITS (1) I've just had contact with evil spirits. (2) Therefore, Creation is true.

67. ARGUMENT FROM HIDDEN LOGIC ( (1) Atheists say that God doesn't exist. (2) But they only say that because they want to look cool and intellectual in front of their peers. (3) They don't fool me! (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

68. ARGUMENT FROM HOVIND'S CHALLENGE (1) Kent Hovind offers $250,000 (which may or may not exist) to anyone who can demonstrate evolution (defined as a natural, acausal origin of the universe) to a reasonable doubt (meaning with 100% certainty, allowing for no other possibilities whatsoever) in front of a neutral committee (handpicked by Hovind himself) and according to certain criteria (carefully worded so as to rule out any possibility whatsoever of the challenge ever being met). (2) No atheist has ever met this challenge. (3)Therefore, Creation is true.

69. ARGUMENT FROM INSANITY (1) No sane person could have thought up Christianity (2) Therefore, it must be true (3) Therefore, Creation is true

70 ARGUMENT FROM EXHAUSTION (abridged) (1) Do you agree with the utterly trivial proposition X? (2) Atheist: of course. (3) How about the slightly modified proposition X'? (4) Atheist: Um, no, not really. (5) Good. Since we agree, how about Y? Is that true? (6) Atheist: No! And I didn't agree with X'! (7) With the truths of these clearly established, surely you agree that Z is true as well? (8) Atheist: No. So far I have only agreed with X! Where is this going, anyway? (9) I'm glad we all agree..... .... (37) So now we have used propositions X, X', Y, Y', Z, Z', P, P', Q and Q' to arrive at the obviously valid point R. Agreed? (38) Atheist: Like I said, so far I've only agreed with X. Where is this going? .... (81) So we now conclude from this that propositions L'', L''' and J'' are true. Agreed? (82) I HAVEN'T AGREED WITH ANYTHING YOU'VE SAID SINCE X! WHERE IS THIS GOING!? .... (177) ...and it follows that proposition HRV, SHQ'' and BTU' are all obviously valid. Agreed? (178) [Atheist either faints from overwork or leaves in disgust] (179) Therefore, Creation is true.

71. MR. GOODSALT'S ARGUMENT (ARGUMENT FROM GENERAL INQUIRY) (1) Question for atheist population: [apparently random question] (2) Your answer is wrong. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

72. PEACOCK ARGUMENT FROM ORIGINALITY (1) I have written the following to demonstrate the existence of God. (2) [insert entire text of a William Lane Craig article] (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

73. PEACOCK ARGUMENT FROM LIMITED VOCABULARY (1) You use lots of big words. (2) Therefore, I cannot possibly be expected to understand your refutation of my position. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

74. PEACOCK ARGUMENT FROM SELECTIVE MEMORY (1) [Christian asks "stumper" question] (2) [Atheist answers question] (3) [A lapse of time] (4) [Christian repeats question] (5) [Atheist repeats answer] (6) [A lapse of time] (7) [Christian repeats question] (8) [Atheist repeats answer] (9) [A lapse of time] (10) Atheist, you never answered my question. (11) Therefore, Creation is true.

75. ARGUMENT FROM HISTORICAL CORRELATION (1) This historical event was recorded. (2) The Bible mentions this event. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

76. THE CLASSICAL CIRCULAR ARGUMENT (1) We know that Creation is true because the Bible tells us so. (2) We know that the Bible is true because it is the word of God (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

77. ARGUMENT FROM SELECTIVE CELEBRITY QUOTATION (1) [insert famous persons name] is a well known Atheist. (2) [insert famous persons name] made a comment about God. (3) Therefore, Creation is true.

78. ARGUMENT FROM IRRELEVANT TRIVIA (1) The Bible was written over a period of 1500 years. (2) Many people from varied backgrounds wrote the Bible. (3) Lots of copies of the Bible have been sold (4) Therefore, Creation is true.

(This is a modification of the 78 "therefore god exists" arguments)

 

wraeththu Experienced

wraeththu

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Επιχείρημα 1

Έπρεπε να το έχεις μεταφράσει για να πάρει μεγαλύτερο μέρος του Insomnia στη συζήτηση. ;-p

Επιχείρημα 2

Μου λείπουν ο theobabis και epote για να πετύχει αυτό το topic... ;-)

Επιχείρημα 3

Ισχύει το θεώρημα του Godel...!!!

 

Πέρα από την πλάκα είναι ένας καλός τρόπος για να δεις τα επιχειρήματα και πως κάνεις λογικά άλματα...

Causabon Experienced

Causabon

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Εξαιρετικά, απίστευτα αστείο. Φοβερό!

Το (ίσως) μόνο δραματικό της υπόθεσης είναι ότι αρκετά από αυτά τα επιχειρήματα έχουν ειπωθεί στην πραγματικότητα ...

 

 

Επίσης, για να βάλω τα πράγματα στη θέση τους, το τελεολογικό επιχείρημα (6ο) έχει διατυπωθεί από τον ʼγιο Θωμά τον Ακινάτη και δεν είναι ακριβώς όπως γράφεις αλλά ως εξής:

"Φυσικά σώματα που στερούνται νοημοσύνης έχουν κάποιο σκοπό στη φύση (π.χ. ο "σκοπός" του χώματος είναι να θρέψει τα φυτά).

Αφού στερούνται νοημοσύνης -και άρα βούλησης- πρέπει να έχουν σχεδιαστεί από κάποιο Δημιουργό (το Θεό)".

 

Το αντεπιχείρημα το αφήνω ως άσκηση στον αναγνώστη <img src="http://www.insomnia.gr/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

 

===

 

ʼλλα παράλογα επιχειρήματα (περί ύπαρξης Θεού) που έχουν ειπωθεί ανά καιρούς:

 

1. Το Ηθικό Επιχείρημα.

"Οι άνθρωποι χαρακτηρίζονται από Ηθική ενώ τα ζώα όχι. Η Ηθική δίνεται στον άνθρωπο από το Θεό. Δίχως το Θεό, (τη μεγαλύτερη πηγή και αυθεντία Ηθικής) δεν υπάρχει παρά ο νόμος της ζούγκλας".

2. Το "Πιστεύω γιατί με ανακουφίζει" επιχείρημα (Maartin Gardner κ.α.).

"Σε θέματα εξαιρετικής σημασίας, όταν αποδείξεις προς την μία ή την άλλη κατεύθυνση είναι αδύνατες και πρέπει να πάρεις μια απόφαση, είναι αποδεκτό να βασιστείς στην απλή πίστη.

3. "Πρωταρχική Αιτία" (πάλι Αγ. Θωμάς ο Ακινάτης).

"Κάθε τι έχει και μια αιτία, αλλά και αυτή η αιτία πρέπει να έχει και μια άλλη, κ.ο.κ. Μιας και δεν μπορεί αυτό να συνεχίζεται επ'άπειρον, χρειαζόμαστε μια πρωταρχική αιτία, η οποία δε χρειάζεται αιτία: Το Θεό".

4. Θαύματα (Βίβλος).

"Το θαύμα αποτελεί εξαιρετικά ασυνήθιστο και ανεξήγητο γεγονός -κατά μερικούς παράκαμψη των νόμων της φύσης- από τη Θεία Βούληση. Δεν υπάρχει άλλη εξήγηση για τα θαύματα, από την ύπαρξη του Θεού".

 

Και η λίστα από τα "επιχειρήματα" που έχουν ειπωθεί γκόουζ ον εντ ον ...

Πάλι, τ'αντεπιχειρήματα θα τα αφήσω ως άσκηση.

 

Καζ.

 

 

kotsifi Experienced

kotsifi

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Δημοσ.

Giati den mas leei kaneis ti leei panw katw ? Den to 3erete oti uparxoun kai tempelhdes,opws egw ? As mas pei kapoios to resume ! <img src="http://www.insomnia.gr/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

yannis27gr Crazy Insomniac

yannis27gr

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wraeththu

said:

Επιχείρημα 2

Μου λείπουν ο theobabis και epote για να πετύχει αυτό το topic... ;-)

 

Ki ego kano apergia se endeiksh sebasmou gia thn elleipsh tou Theobabi. Tetoia topic xoris auton einai analato faghto... <img src="http://www.insomnia.gr/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.insomnia.gr/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Alhtheia, pou exei paei?

 

yannis27gr Crazy Insomniac

yannis27gr

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Δημοσ.
Lucifer

said:

"Is Man an error of God, or God an error of Man?"

-Friedrich Nietzsche

 

Who needz one?

 

An den yparxei Theos den yparxeis ki esy file Lucifer <img src="http://www.insomnia.gr/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.insomnia.gr/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.insomnia.gr/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.insomnia.gr/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

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